[00:00] Valerie Beck: You ever meet someone and find yourself thinking, whoa, I want to be like them when I grow up? Well, for me, that person is my new friend, Walden Cox, aka Walthrax, aka Black Metal Axe. A 12 time world record holding trick shot champion in axe and knife throwing. A touring metal musician, an artist, and one of the most fascinating people I've ever had the pleasure of interviewing for this podcast. You might have seen him on the history channels, ultimate marksman, but trust me, there's way more to his story than what you've seen on tv. From his wild child beginnings, to international tours, to becoming a champion in the world of trick shot axe throwing, Walden has always prioritized one living authentically on his own terms. This episode will help you tap into your intuition, creativity, and how it feels to carve your own path in life without apology. And because Walden is Walden, we didn't even ease into this conversation. He jumped right in, right from the moment he was born. This is from the ashes where every episode ignites hope and healing.
[01:15] Walden Cox: If you really want to get into it, I'm going to start at the very beginning. And so that means I was born to a very, very hippie couple on essentially the outside of a commune. There was. I wasn't. They didn't live there, we had our own place, that kind of stuff. But we were involved in a very community, communal based lifestyle. And that was up on a place called Friday harbor on San Juan island in the Puget Sound of Washington state, really near Canada. So I was born on an island, very isolated, didn't even know what a TV was until I moved to the mainland when I was 7. I was like, what is this magic, right? And so was raised very like a wild child, basically. I got to run around these crazy forests and just do whatever I wanted when I was like two or three, it was wild. And so then moved to the mainland. Who was Bellingham, Washington, when my brother was born. And at this point, my mother had become a full time art teacher and my father had gone back to school for theoretical physics. So drastic shift. And so my brother grew up with a totally different set of parents that I grew up with, which is very interesting cause I've always been the black sheep of my family because of that. So fast forward a few years, start getting very into sports, you know, was very good at basketball and track for the most part, decent at soccer. Played those all the way through, halfway through high school, and it's about 10th grade. And at that point I discovered guitar. And that was just because of a new group of friends I ran across. And so I started playing acoustic guitar. And it was really. It was weird because it was a Christian youth group like that I was hanging out with, Even though I wasn't religious at all. They were just nice people, started learning guitar through them. And then that sort of led to playing the guitar in the quad one day, right? At this point, I'm very artistic. I'm always doing stuff I shouldn't do, like tagging things. But I always try to make murals out of them, you know, actually make real art. So we did a bunch of weird stuff like that. And then I met this group of kids that had a band and they're like, do you play bass? And I was like, yeah. And I'd never touched a bass in my life, but I was like, yeah, I could do that. I play guitar because I was playing Metallica songs on an acoustic guitar, like fairly well for a ninth grader, I guess, in the quad. So they asked me to join the band. I joined the band. That leads to basically 20 years of professional musicianship. That band got signed, joined another band that was signed. Eventually I was in three different signed bands. This is all before I graduated high school. And so then at that point toured the world. Been to about 60 some odd countries doing music and in like live art, kind of like theater kind of stuff.
[04:05] Valerie Beck: Okay.
[04:05] Walden Cox: They got involved in puppetry after that. I've done almost 3,500 original pieces of music, depending on what you like to classify as music. Some of its ambience and weird background noises. Because I, you know, essentially was working with theater groups and stuff and basically making live soundtracks, but recorded all that and put it all out. So I have tons of music out there. Some of it which I don't even remember where I put it online or what it was called because I just started dumping it everywhere at that point. Started losing interest in playing in bands and writing music. So I started making new bands that were anti bands, basically. So we would show up to a gig and literally just somebody would start doing something. And then everyone else just starts playing along. And so it's kind of like jazz, but way weirder. And we do this in a metal setting, but it wasn't metal music. So we really just were. At this point, we became the art project. And the project was a bunch of people pretending to be a band in front of a real audience. And that actually started going somewhere. And then Covid happened and it fell apart. Weirdly, when Covid happens, at that point, I've already become a semi professional Ax and knife thrower, just because it was fun. And that starts blowing up and because of Instagram starts blowing up because I started doing these weird trick shot videos that started going progressively more and more viral. And then eventually it got up to, like, the several millions of views and sometimes the tens of millions of views on some of these videos. And that completely took over my life. So music started taking a huge background to that. So where I'm at nowadays is in four weeks, about to go to the world championships for ax throwing. And this is the last time I'm going, whether I win or not, because I'm losing interest in the competitive side. Because to me, everything I got from it was art. I was doing something no one else was doing. Yeah. So I'm always just been this artist. And so that mindset's starting to lead me back into the music and the actual art again. So now I'm about to start crossing all of these different worlds into new things. So that's kind of where I'm at. And I got into WPA because I feel like I actually have something I can share with people. And that's kind of it, I guess. As long as you think it's good, I'm good.
[06:24] Valerie Beck: All right. This is. This is great because you're speaking my language, doing the art for the sake of the art, rather than, like, fitting into one box. You're actually just doing it all and doing it all at once. And it seems like you're exploring a lot too, which is super cool. And then distilling down, like, what is the essence of what you are trying to do? And it feels like you're trying to live a creative life. And there's something. There's a truth behind that, I think that is, like, coming into form. At least this is how I'm interpreting everything that you're saying. And there's just a lot, though, that I. I have questions about. You know, awesome. Because, like, we've. We've been in the circles together for a little bit, but I don't know too much about your background. And I want to hear a little bit about those from the Ashes moments, Phoenix moments where you have chosen to pivot and, like, how easy for you it was to pivot or how hard it was for you to pivot at those times. And, like, with the whole trick shot thing, just so that the audience knows, Walden basically throws axes.
[07:28] Walden Cox: Axes and knives and really anything, honestly. But those are the primary things. Yes.
[07:33] Valerie Beck: He throws them really accurately at different things. And it's just amazing to Watch. Check out his Instagram. But, you know, going from, like, metal musician to artists to trick shots and all of that, what was your process and how did you get into all of those things?
[07:53] Walden Cox: Well, each one of those was like an explosive moment of self discovery, I think you. I could say. And each one of those came naturally through the process of something starting to fizzle out on its own. So as those. Those, you know, Phoenix wings are starting to lose their luster, something is starting to gestate already. And there's an explosive moment where it's like a polar shift. And sometimes it's been easy because I'm ready for it. And there's been other times where it's been harder because you can. Like right now, for example, it's a little harder because I can see it coming instead of it just happening. So trying to. What's the right word? Trying to, like, you know, just welcome it without rushing it. You know, like, it has to happen naturally because the first few things that, like, the first few big shifts I went through were shockingly fast. Like when I went from, like, a very focused athlete to musician within six months of picking up that first guitar, I was in a band that then exploded. And it was this massive shift. Very quickly. I just embraced it and just went with it was what made it sort of easy to do. And then. But now that I'm starting to see that there's a bigger. A bigger thing happening amongst all of these, there's a similar energy in all of them. I'm starting to see that. That it's coming. And that's the hard part is like, okay, just let it happen naturally. Welcome it in. Don't hurry it. You know, that's. It's very esoteric to try to describe it, but I don't know.
[09:38] Valerie Beck: Well, all right, so I'm going to use some common language that we have between us, and I'll explain it to the audience as we go. Because I don't know if you've heard Kate talk about fractals at all.
[09:48] Walden Cox: I have heard, yes, only a little bit because, you know, like, being fairly new to that. And then the fact that I've been kind of in and out recently, like, yeah, I've heard the term and I'm aware of it, but I'm not 100% on it.
[10:02] Valerie Beck: All right, so I'll. I'll explain it in the a nutshell. And it's basically like throughout life, we're going to. If we're paying attention, we have these patterns that show up in our Life again and again. And it. It points us to where we're going in terms of our own purpose, our growth and whatnot. And if we start to pay attention, we can see that there are those patterns that we are leading ourselves to. Right. And so the. The fact that you have been able to pivot from one type of mastery to another, and then it has led you to something a little bit more distilled each time, and you're starting to see, like, what the essence of that is. That's the fractal part of it. Right.
[10:46] Walden Cox: Okay. Yeah.
[10:47] Valerie Beck: The thing about a fractal is, like, the more you see the patterns, the more aware of it you become, and the more you can foresee what's gonna happen next.
[10:53] Walden Cox: Yeah, right. But you don't know where I'm at. Yeah, that's exactly kind of where I'm at right now. Like I said, I guess there's an apprehension in wanting to rush it, I guess, if that makes sense. Because everything's happened so naturally in the past. Seeing that fractal or, you know, like, being aware of this shift, it's. To see. It's almost like I'm afraid I'd ruin it, you know, by not letting it happen on its own. Being aware of it is very comfortable, but it's also kind of frightening. So. So that's. I don't know. It's interesting when you put it that way, because now it's just like, wait, okay, that makes total sense. But, wow, now I'm more confused. Yeah.
[11:39] Valerie Beck: I mean, I. I've seen my own fractal and seeing kind of like the big leaps that I've made, and each time, they are really big leaps, and they've changed my ways and just changed my life very dramatically all at once. And it was me making the decision, though, Right? And.
[11:55] Walden Cox: Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[11:57] Valerie Beck: And it was you making the decision each time, too, right?
[11:59] Walden Cox: Well, yeah, it was, but like I said, it was more. I guess it was more just giving into the moment and the opportunity than chasing it and recognizing it. Was recognizing it when it was in front of my face more, as opposed to seeing it coming.
[12:13] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[12:14] Walden Cox: So that's the difference this time is, like, I'm seeing it coming as opposed to just popping up and being like, boo. You know?
[12:20] Valerie Beck: So what I think what she was saying about this is that this is. This is our superpower, if we use it correctly. And so I am interested in. And how you want. So now that you're aware of it. Right. How you want to utilize this superpower that you have?
[12:39] Walden Cox: All right, Well, I actually kind of can answer that a little bit, at least what I'm trying to do at this point is my overall passion really, is to let everyone to help guide other people to find the joy and discovering themselves that I did. Because that's what this has all been, really, is me discovering who I really am. And all of these parts are me, but they're only part of me. And so now that I'm distilling them all down into one thing that is essentially, you know, chasing the art of creativity, you know, and being able to live in that and have a message that even if you're the only one that understands it, you have a message you can get out and that that's the most important thing. You're not chasing art or anything for the commodity of it. You're more chasing it for the fulfillment. Yeah. Because to me, when. When I'm on my deathbed, I'm not going to think about how much money I made. I'm going to think about how many lives I changed and how many smiles I created. And that's kind of the big goal for me. And, you know, is like, I want to know that I helped other people become the people that they knew that they should be, even if they didn't know what it was.
[14:00] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[14:01] Walden Cox: So that's kind of where I'm at.
[14:03] Valerie Beck: So there's something really powerful about this philosophy of becoming, as Seth Godin would put it.
[14:11] Walden Cox: Okay.
[14:11] Valerie Beck: He has this book that's called this is Strategy. It's one of my favorite books right now. But the first line is strategy is the philosophy of becoming. And I think as artists who have really stuck to their creativity realize that the power is in the enjoyment of becoming and this discovery of it. And yeah, you're right in that it's not really about the money. It's about how much you contributed to others because you were so joyful in the process of creation. Does that sound kind of like what you're getting at?
[14:52] Walden Cox: Yes, actually, I'm not familiar with that now. I'm very excited to check that book out. I'll have to have you send me that title and all that again, like when we're done. A huge audiobook nerd. Because having been a audio file for so long, I learn and retain so much better that way than if I'm actually trying to read something with my eyes. And so if that's something that's available, audio wise, I will be all over it and I'll finish it in half the time. You're supposed to because I listen to it quick.
[15:23] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[15:23] Walden Cox: But like, that's. That's odd to have you phrase it so succinctly and have it actually resonate. So. Yeah, I do definitely, you know, find some very curious value in that.
[15:37] Valerie Beck: Yeah. And I think that's something that comes with a lot of that exploration that you've done naturally since the beginning of your life. And I've thought about my fractals and just like, what I've been trying to do my entire life, and it's really hard to put into words. I feel like that's what you're saying too.
[15:58] Walden Cox: It's.
[15:58] Valerie Beck: It's like really. It was. It has been really hard to put into the. To words forever because it's. It's not. It's not like something you could just like, package right away and be like, this is what I'm going to give you.
[16:11] Walden Cox: It's.
[16:12] Valerie Beck: Yeah, that's the dilemma.
[16:14] Walden Cox: Yeah.
[16:14] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[16:15] Walden Cox: Because every single person's journey is going to be completely different. So it's. The package is simple. It's a. It's a guiding hand, like, to help you walk your own path, really. I mean, but it's also. That's so simplified that it doesn't really do it justice. But it's like, that's kind of what it is because otherwise, like, trying to really come up and package. This is the issue I've actually been having the hardest time with because it's such a. I don't know, it's a bizarre thing. Like, you don't really see this sort of thing very often. So there's not a lot of places for me to even model any of this after, you know, but that's good because I've never really modeled myself after anyone anyway. So I should be doing this as like, this is part of the new art form is figuring out how to merge all these into this program where I can actually use it to help people.
[17:09] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[17:10] Walden Cox: You know, and. But that's the. That's the hardest part. You can't even if there was plays analogs basically to. To be able to, you know, pick and choose little pieces of. That's sort of going against the grain of what I'm trying to actually do. So that's the issue I've been having is kind of finalizing everything and truly packaging everything.
[17:31] Valerie Beck: Yeah. I definitely feel that that has been my. My journey as well. I want to ask you. Well, let's go back to this from the ashes concept.
[17:43] Walden Cox: Yeah, let's do that.
[17:44] Valerie Beck: And let's well, let's start with your story of times where there has been a lot of struggle and where you have had to overcome certain limiting beliefs or, like, you know, I don't know, some kind of essential challenge to help you get to that next step in life and how that connects now with the type of people that you want to help and the types of issues that you want to address.
[18:13] Walden Cox: Hmm. Okay. So I'm just going to attempt this because I'm not sure if this is relevant or not, but it's an early. It's an early example, and that's when I first started getting very into. For playing music and for wanting to pursue it professionally. The first band I was in was all my contemporaries were all teenagers. But then the following bands that I got recruited into were people that were 15, 16 years older than me. And so being very excited to jump into that was like, yes, all right, there's already something established here. We can get going. I can help me establish myself as a bass player or whatever. But then you quickly find that you're a tool for them. And because you're basically half their age, they don't really treat you with any respect. Like, they might have fun with you, but, like, you're really not an equal part of anything. And so that. That went on for a good 10 years in the music industry for me, and that's when I started being like, I'm kind of tired of this. I'm gonna start making my own stuff. And so I did that. And I would say within a year, I transitioned out completely from playing in other people's bands to just doing my own things. And that was. It was hard because I was doing something I loved. I was completely. You know, I was enjoying most of the time. I was touring and playing music and recording, even rehearsals and everything that went with it, but it wasn't fulfilling me the right way. Like, so it was a. That was the first real dilemma was like, I'm gonna have to walk away from this to pursue what I want to do. Then that was kind of scary because it's like, I've really established myself. I've had some. I had some very incredible offers that only in hindsight were incredible. Like, at the time, or I could have been a bass player for a couple different incredibly famous bands right now. And at the time, I was like, that's not the direction I want to go.
[20:17] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[20:18] Walden Cox: Now, they weren't. They weren't anything either at the time, but now it's just like, wow, if I would have just made A different decision. I'd probably have no financial problems at all and I'd still be playing bass and it'd be fun and, you know, I wouldn't be fulfilled, but it would be fun. But that happened at least. At least twice. And there's a couple other potentials that might have gone through as well, but I don't have any regrets about that. And that's one of those things where, you know, sometimes hindsight can be a real. Like a real burden.
[20:48] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[20:49] Walden Cox: You know, like, because you start thinking, I could have made this decision, I could have made that decision. And even after you have those thoughts, it's healthy to process those thoughts if you have them, if you do have them. But you have to, you actually have to process them. You can't dwell. And that's one of the things I've been pretty good at, is being able to move forward regardless of the fear of the consequence of moving forward. And that's something that a lot of people, at least in my circles, have. Like, a lot of people are stuck in ruts because it's comfortable enough and they're afraid of what might happen if they try to break out of that rut. And so I feel like that's something I can give to people or I can at least help them discover and if nothing else, through my own story or, well, several stories really, of all of this, you know, I have several examples of that sort of thing, but that was the most. That was the first real, real big one, I think, you know, so. Because before that shifting, all the shifts before that, when I was young were just like, woohoo, let's do this. Oh, that's great, awesome, Cool. And I wasn't really giving up anything that had. It was. That wasn't just fun for. For different fun and then. But once I started really having a vision of what I wanted, you know, it was like, I can't do that if I'm doing this, so I have to go on. And so it's like being able to recognize those decisions and stick with them, you know, like, regardless of whether there's.
[22:20] Valerie Beck: Fear or apprehension there, that's a huge one. I can definitely relate because there have been times where I've had. I've made said no to things that other people would think I'm crazy for saying no to. I've given up things that people and relationships that people would have thought were like, the ones I should have taken. And it was in the interest of me being true to myself, which is something that, like, it's Hard to justify sometimes.
[22:52] Walden Cox: Yeah, because everyone else sees what you do and that's not what they do. So they're going to question it and then they're going to make you question yourself. So you can't make all your decisions based off what other people think you should do. You live your world, you live your own life through your own eyes. You're not through other one. Everyone else is. It's good to be able to step outside and see through those eyes. But you shouldn't have to do that, you know, like, unless, like, there's examples, like there's times when it's going to pop up. You're like, oh, I wonder what this actually comes off as, you know, like, what did I just really say there? You know? But we all live our own lives. We're all born alone and die alone, ultimately. And it's a matter of being happy and feeling fulfilled and finding the right people to be happy and fulfilled with and just to be able to be like, yes, that ride was awesome. You know, like, if it isn't right at Disneyland, like, I want to do it again. That was rad. Or like, that was awful. Like, I don't. I would much rather have the first option there. I'd much rather be like, okay, cool. I don't know if I made the right decisions, but I made the right decisions for me. Yeah, that's. And like, it's hard sometimes. It's really, really hard to not second guess yourself because other people don't understand what you're doing.
[24:08] Valerie Beck: Well, yeah, because also sometimes it feels like you're making decisions against what might be successful. Right?
[24:16] Walden Cox: Yeah. Yeah. But you're chasing a different type of success.
[24:20] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[24:21] Walden Cox: Success outside of yourself. Success is very easy to see somebody gain or lose. It's really easy to watch it happen. But to be on the inside and actually have it happen and then lose it and have it happen again and then lose it, it's a totally different experience. You know, seeing life through your own eyes is so different than seeing it through someone else's lives. Perfect example is watching tv. You watch TV and it's like you're sucked into a story which can ultimately be awesome or not. Maybe you see all the changes coming, maybe you don't, but it's different than being that story, you know? Like, it's weird to say that we all live our own movies, but like, we kind of do, you know, but like, it's a matter of making those movies or those stories or whatever flow together in a big, big river, not just Be a bunch of different little tributaries and streams. If we can get here all that, get all that water into one thing. There's a lot of power there. I'm kind of losing it here. I don't know where.
[25:20] Valerie Beck: I have more questions, if that's okay.
[25:22] Walden Cox: Yeah, go for it. Go for it. I kind of talked myself into a corner. Was like, I don't know. That was a neat metaphor, but I don't know what, Like, I lost it. So go ahead.
[25:30] Valerie Beck: Okay, well, because I have. I have been stuck in patterns of resentment in my life because of, let's say, how people are treating me as lesser, right? So this, you know, the experience that you had with the bands and them, not because you were younger, you know, not getting that respect that you would have liked to have with, from your, from your peers, right? From your fellow band members. And then, like, realizing that in order to, to have that respect, like, you do your own thing and, like, stand up for yourself. How did you let. Cuz, for me having that experience, I know how much I carried that resentment for a long time. And like, I, I, I emotionally struggled with people not seeing me the way that I wanted to be seen and not understanding why. Like, for me, I internalized it too. Like, you know, what is it about me that's not enough? But was there any of that for you, too? And, like, if so, how did you overcome that?
[26:38] Walden Cox: Yes, there definitely was. And honestly, I can't say that I've completely overcame came that at all. Like, sometimes there are moments of that still. But yeah, like, I found myself as recently as like a decade ago, like. Like, for some reason, it's out of nowhere dwelling on that first band, wondering what those dudes are all up to, if they're even alive, and like, what the hell? And blah, blah, blah. And so, like, even though I'd buried that one and came to terms with it, it still popped up a little bit. And it was like, okay, whatever. Then, weirdly, I actually contacted one of them and got back with him. We chatted for a while and it was cool. So it was like, oh, that's neat. Right on. And we didn't even talk about any of the band stuff. It was more just like, what are you doing now? Blah, blah, blah. Do you still play at all? Like, you know, how's life? That kind of thing. And that helped me kind of process the whole thing. Like, all of it, even. Not just him, but, like, all of the. All of it. Because it's just like, oh, we're all just people. None of that's even happening anymore. You know, it doesn't matter how things ended, because now we're here, and that's. I try to. I would say my easiest way to cope with that is to realize that I'm in this moment now, and I'm not in that moment then anymore. And it's. It's. It has to become a mantra sometimes for me where it's more just like, focus on right now, because future is not guaranteed in the past. You can't change it. So just focus on right now. And currently I'm having a huge issue with that because I. Like I said, in a month from now, I have to go to Wisconsin for the World Ax Throwing Championships. And I'm so torn about it right now because part I already know this is the last one I'm going to. Whether I win or lose doesn't matter, just because it's time to move on a little bit because that's. That is going to be a distraction from what I'm actually trying to do now. But there's a little bit of, like, grief already, even though it hasn't happened yet. Just. Just like, oh, I put so much into this, but it's like, well, but that is what helped get to where I am now. So there's always a grieving period for sure, but it's a matter of just telling yourself, it's okay. You made this decision for a reason. The reason I dropped out of those bands that I had resentment towards, to follow my own thing was to prove to. Not only to them that I could do it, but to prove myself that I could do it. It wasn't just like, hey, I want to do something else, but I don't even know if I can. So let's just do it and see what happens. And then it works. And it's like, okay, cool.
[29:10] Valerie Beck: Whoo.
[29:11] Walden Cox: But like I said, now I'm seeing it coming a little bit more. So trying to prepare for it and welcome it with open arms, but also strategize for it. It's. It's. It's a whole new thing, and it's got a whole different new type of anxiety and nerves with it. It's kind of fun. Yeah.
[29:29] Valerie Beck: Well.
[29:29] Walden Cox: Yeah.
[29:29] Valerie Beck: So I. I mean, it seems like you're not afraid of the hard work, right? Because every time you start over, it's like starting from the bottom again.
[29:36] Walden Cox: Oh, yeah. There's so many times I'm like, I could have just kept doing what I was doing 20 years ago, and I definitely would have got somewhere. But it's like I was bored of it by then and I wasn't putting my full passion and my full true self into it. And part of what I realized is part of me is being that chameleon and that shapeshifter. That's part of my art at this point. That's part of my person. So it's like, you have to welcome this. You have to do this. Because I guarantee even though I'm seeing it now, this isn't the last time this is going to happen. You know, like, I know that up until my dying day I'm going to be constantly going through shifts and I'm going to constantly be modifying who I am because I'm discovering something new about myself. And like I said, that's where I want to help other people find that passion for their own self discovery. And so, yeah, that's kind of my, my, my new art is helping people find it, Find the art of being themselves. It within themselves.
[30:33] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[30:33] Walden Cox: So that can be people, People might want to, maybe they wish they were a painter and they never, they never even tried it. Like weirdly, I got a lot of background in that. I can actually help with that. And then they could chase that. Maybe they'll be like, this isn't right. And then they'll try something else. And, but not being afraid didn't make those attempts. And just because it might, maybe that wasn't what you really wanted, but you wouldn't, you didn't know that until you tried it. And that's, that's me. That's me. You know, like, like all these things are part of what I really want. I haven't found it all yet, but I'm on that, I'm on that mission. I'm on that journey, you know, so.
[31:10] Valerie Beck: Yeah, right on. I, I think that's a really good way of looking at it. It's just like I'm on the mission. I have found parts of myself and like, for me I know because like I've, you know, I've danced, I've, I've, I've been a tour guide internationally. I've been a teacher. I, I've been a clinician for Ayurveda. I, I did my massage therapy training and then like a couple months later promptly decided to drop that. I've tried a lot of things and sometimes it feels like I am leaving stuff half baked.
[31:43] Walden Cox: I know that feeling. I was a paramedic for a minute. Yeah, just like your, your, your school with the massage therapy. I did the same thing with medic school, like went all the way through the whole thing, passed it, and then stopped. So I have a lot of skills that I've very rarely had to use, but those are, those skills are very handy because if you need to be able to use them and there's no one else who can, it's nice to have that information. And there have been times since that school where that information did come in very handy. So even though that was a, quote, failed attempt at finding myself, I found part of myself. And that part might be a very small part of myself, but it has proven to have not been a waste of time, at least.
[32:25] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[32:26] Walden Cox: Like so. But like, I can super relate to that.
[32:29] Valerie Beck: Yeah. I. It is difficult sometimes to not get lost in the, like the. Are you crazy?
[32:41] Walden Cox: The self talk.
[32:42] Valerie Beck: Right. Is like, are you crazy?
[32:43] Walden Cox: Yeah, I got a little voice right here that just constantly telling me I'm crazy. And another one over here is like, no, I don't listen to that guy. You're crazy. But not the way he's telling you. So they've got two different crazies going on, you know, like, oh, it's, it's, it's bizarre. Yeah. Self doubt can be a huge, A huge crutch and it can lead to depression. And I've definitely had those moments of like three, four solid months of just nothing.
[33:13] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[33:14] Walden Cox: Just sitting around just like, this sucks. I don't even know what I want to do. I don't even have anything I want to do right now. But then all of a sudden, out of nowhere, bam. Spark of creativity and off to the races again. And those have been pretty far and few between for me. But I can't say I'm immune to it.
[33:30] Valerie Beck: Yeah. I mean, I feel like it's hard because there are always going to be like, maybe the. It's like what Kate talks about when she says, like there's, there's a space, right. Like where there's nothing. Where you have to deal with the void.
[33:46] Walden Cox: Yeah.
[33:47] Valerie Beck: But the void is where all the creativity comes from.
[33:49] Walden Cox: Exactly. Like sometimes you don't see it coming. It just pop. There it is. Yeah.
[33:55] Valerie Beck: Yeah. So I've been really exploring. Yeah. Exploring to be comfortable with having nothing and doing and being nothing for a second.
[34:04] Walden Cox: Yeah. No, Like, I can feel that it's hard for me, but I can feel it. And I do find my moments of Zen and nothingness, but then I have those moments of self doubt. That's like I could be doing something else, but I don't know what it is. And then that Ruins it. And it's just like, then you got to find that nothingness again and that Zen again. But it's, it's a meditation and sometimes it's easy to fall into it and sometimes it's really hard to stay in it. And I've definitely had my moments of both. And even recently, like I said, you know, with like seeing all this stuff coming to a head all at once, there have been definite moments of just pure stagnation, you know, like I can't even get myself to want to do anything, but I'm gonna go do dishes and do random stuff around the house so I don't feel worthless. But I've definitely, like, I've had those recently, like up for like a week at a time. But then it's followed by this huge burst of positivity and productivity that's like almost unfathomably. Unfathomably. Gosh, that was a hard word to say. But it's like, it's so much happens so quickly and it's such a positive way that it's almost unbelievable. So when you look back at the time you sat there waiting for it and then when it happened and happened successfully, it's like, okay. Overall, that still was very productive time. You know, like, maybe because of how fast and easy things just happened, if you would have tried to force it during that time of stagnation right before it, maybe it wouldn't have worked out as well. Who knows? But that's that self doubt hindsight stuff. You just gotta embrace the now. And sometimes the now isn't exciting, but sometimes it is. So.
[35:50] Valerie Beck: If you're listening to this, I want you to know that you are a badass visionary. The world doesn't need a watered down version of you. It needs you fully alive, fully expressed, fully thriving. Club Phoenix is where we work together to help you break free from burnout and build a life on your own terms. If you're done playing small book a call with me through my link in the show notes and let's make it happen today. I think that leads pretty well into why I. Why you're focusing a lot on the mental health now and the mental wellness now. Right?
[36:28] Walden Cox: Yeah.
[36:29] Valerie Beck: So can you tell me a little bit about. Yeah, your, your journey into this, this wellness space, which at first glance might seem a little bit out of left field.
[36:40] Walden Cox: Very. At first glance, it was very out of left field for me. My wife Kirsten had. This has been something that she's been like, very passionate about for a long time and she's Been part of the WPA with Kate longer than I have, but she found something in what I was doing where she realized, we should work with what you do instead of me forcing what I do. We should be. What you do is very unique with the way you. And so we should focus on that because that way we have some. A very. A totally different type of program to offer totally different people. And, you know, there's. There's something to your story. And I was like, okay, cool, I'm down. Like, why not? Blah, blah, blah. Just sort of. Just sort of dipped my toe in to see what it was about and realized that that's what kind of made me realize that I've always sort of been mental health adjacent because I've always preached this regardless of what it is. Like, even. Even in the competitive axe throwing thing. Now, part of the reason why I'm the black sheep of the community to the very competitive people and the organizations is because I'm there for the fun of it. Even at the world championship level, you'll find me just gabbing and having fun instead of actually focusing on what I'm doing, because I'm there for the experience. I mean, the winning's cool, but so is losing. Who cares? Like, whatever. We're there for fun, period. And then there's. There's all these issues that'll pop up within this sport, and they always cause a lot of division and arguments. And I always pop in on those little chats and I'm like, if this is making this not fun for you, why do you do it? And I'm always just posing those questions. And some people get very upset at those questions because they're like, whatever, dude. Blah, blah, blah, Mr. Trick shot over here. And I'm like, you ever see me not smiling? You ever see me not having fun? I'm like, I'm winning in my mind. Just because you have a higher score than me right now, who cares? Like, whatever. You might win this two minute little match. We do. But overall, I'm the one who's gonna walk away just like, that was rad, no matter what happens. And so, yeah, it's kind of. I don't know, kind of talk myself into a corner again, like, sort of lost my train of thought.
[39:00] Valerie Beck: Well, I think what you're getting at is mindset, right?
[39:02] Walden Cox: Because. Yeah, yeah, it's about staying true to your belief of the fact that you can win without winning. Because, you know, you don't have to win a competition to win the moment. You know, it's like I don't care about that. I mean, that's not true. I do care about it, but I don't care about it to the level that other people care about it. Like I cared about it with the music. I wanted to be a signed touring musician. I really did. And I got to be that. And then I realized that was only part of what I wanted. And so just all, all those different experiences, going through all of that, all the way up to what I'm doing now with the axe and knife throwing stuff just made me realize that I'm looking for the moment. I'm looking for the, the true interactions with people. I'm. I'm looking for true moments of being myself and just being happy and being myself. And sometimes those moments are steeped in loss and failure. But sometimes those moments are the highest things you'll ever achieve. But most of them are in the middle and they're everyday things and you can find joy in everything if you, if you are open to it. And that was my big battle in the beginning. But then I took those risks and it led me here. And so can't say I feel like I made any bad decisions. Just maybe questionable ones, but not bad ones.
[40:26] Valerie Beck: How did you get into the ax throwing?
[40:30] Walden Cox: That's a interesting story, kind of. It started when I was a little kid throwing pocket knives and old butter knives and just things at trees in the forest when I was like five and getting in trouble for that, like I should have, and then getting into sports, blah blah, blah, blah, blah, all the way through that. And then when I met up with Kirsten, so around 20 years ago, we were doing some martial arts together because, like, this will be fun. And the guy we were learning from kind of taught us the basics of knife throwing. And I was like, oh, this seems very familiar. I kind of did this as a kid and didn't really get any in depth training, just got some basics and that was just in and out, just whatever here and there. And then right around 2012, 2011, 2012, it just out of nowhere, like, I want some axes, I want to be all Viking. I want to throw stuff. That'll be cool. And I didn't know what I was doing, but it was fun. And I was like, that'll be great. Let's just break stuff in my own yard. What's the worst that can happen? I got to clean up a mess. Who cares? And so I did that and did that for years and years and years and years without even knowing anyone else ever really did this. Like I was an axe thrower for probably eight years before I found out that anyone else had any sort of interest in it, let alone there was a whole professional league and a whole community based around it. Because I didn't do social media at all. I had no idea. And so, funny story, we go to a Mexican food restaurant in 2018, and maybe it was 2019. No, it doesn't matter. Whatever, it was before COVID and we're sitting there eating food, blah, blah, blah, and the TVs are playing stuff. And on ESPN2, all of a sudden there's ax throwing. And it was behind me. And Kirsten's like, hey, look at that. And I'm like, oh, what? Those guys are really close to the target. What's that about? Like, because I'm used to throwing from really far away and doing all kinds of nutty stuff with axes. I'm like, this looks boring. But like, whatever, who cares? That's pretty neat. It's on tv and it's neat to know other people. It. And then kind of out of sight, out of mind. Then she starts seeing, like, things on Facebook about, you know, ax throwing bars. I'm like, they're really doing that? What? And I had the same question. Everyone else has alcohol and axes. That doesn't seem like a good idea. Whatever. And then a couple months after that, one of her friends was having a birthday and she's like, let's go be social. I'm like, why don't you get all those girls to just bring a bunch of beer over here? And I have a giant target here. We could save hundreds of dollars. She's like, that's not what they want to do. They want to go to the place. I'm like, all right, I'll go, fine. So we go, and in this two hour session that we're there with like 14 other girls and one other guy, our coach, like, he's like, who wants to be my demonstration person? And all of them point at me because they already know I do it in the backyard. And I'm like, fine, whatever. And I just hit bullseye after bullseye in demonstration. And he's like, well, you're pretty good at this. You've done this before. I'm like, in my backyard? I didn't know places like this existed until a couple months ago. He's like, it doesn't seem like it. I'm like, this is the truth. And then he's like, do you want a part time job? And I was like, man, I got a good job. I'm good. He's like, no, seriously, do you want a part time job? You're really good at this. Like you should coach people. And I was like, eh. He's like, I will literally let you write your own schedule. And I was like, what? Sure, why not? So fast forward to now. I have worked at least one part time ax throwing coaching job ever since because it's super fun and I love it, but so I jump in there and I'm just goofing off, doing my. My same thing that I do. And then like I said, you know, I'm just kind of throwing stuff around, getting weird, having fun. People are like, you should make an Instagram account. I'm like, why? Like, I don't care about social media whatsoever. Why should I do that? It's just going to be a time suck, you know, whatever. I play in a band, I do this. I have family, blah, blah, blah. I don't have time for that. Like, you should just do it, dude. Just I gotta do is film a little clip of the trick shot, put it out, people will like it. And I'm like, whatever, sure. And so I do it for the first six months or so. It's cool. And like I start getting a couple hundred followers and a thousand. I'm like, that's kind of neat. Getting some dopamine release, you know, all that fun stuff. And then Covid happens and I don't have much to do other than go out in my yard and throw. So I'm like, whatever. So I just start filming and filming and filming. I think between all of my social media platforms now I have probably 8,000 videos out.
[44:59] Valerie Beck: Wow.
[44:59] Walden Cox: And during COVID those numbers went from like 1,000 to 10,000. And then I started a different like, like a YouTube channel that then did the same thing. And like it's all of a sudden it's all these different things and they're all blowing up and it's like, there's something to this. That's pretty cool. So after Covid, I decide, eh, I might as well try to do some of these competitions. Because like, why not? I'm super in the world. Everyone in this world's following me now. I might as well go, let's see what this is about. And so I go and I do. Okay, I'm not doing great because I don't really focus on their game. I focus on what I do. It just happens to be adjacent to what they do. So I show up at these things and everyone's like, cool. Right on. Hey man, what you do is really neat. We like watching it. And then I realized I'm just like a court jester to them, basically, because they don't. They take. They do something different than I do, just with the same thing. So to. They don't understand what I do, none of that. And so it's fine. I don't care. And they start doing better and better in their competitions. So I'm getting better at their game while taking my game to an absurd level that they can't even imagine. And so I'm at the point now where I'm like, not even interested in their game anymore, but I'm going to go because I'm developing my own game. And my own game is like, well, throw ax, feel good. You know, throw through what you go through. It's about like, this isn't the sport. This is the fun hobby. You guys are trying to ruin it with your sport. I'm trying to make this awesome, like truly awesome for everyone who does it. And the way that I've approached it, I feel like I can really do this. I feel like it can really affect people's lives with such a simple, simple action. And it's like, cool, let's just get in it. Because literally anyone could throw an ax and I could teach you how to do it well really quickly. And that brings a lot of smiles to a lot of people's faces. Then that leads to big, fun conversations like this too. So, you know, you get to know people all through some silly thing I did in my backyard, you know, and that to me, is really powerful because I chased this on stages all over the world for like two decades. And I found it better in my own backyard than I ever found it anywhere else in the world. But it doesn't mean any of that was wasted time either. Doesn't mean any of that journey was not relevant because I wouldn't have found this if it wasn't for that. And so now I'm trying to harness all that energy again and be able to take what I'm doing now literally on the road. Like, I have potentials to go to like, Czech Republic and other places in Europe this summer doing this. And like, I never would have seen this coming, like, up until literally, I would say beginning of 2025 was when I realized that I can do this and kind of combine it with some of the other art and music stuff. So I can stay in a spot a little longer than one day. But I can, I can do this and I can use some of the skills that I'VE had in the past to make this actually work. And I can create an entirely new program, slash hobby, slash entertainment, like, whatever. I can create a whole new basically product out of this that no one's ever really done. And I can take that physically on the road. And because of technology now I can keep. I can do it online. So like I said, I can find the magic I was looking for on the road in my own backyard, but then I can take that magic that I found back on the road. So that's kind of the roundabout mystery of what I'm trying to do. And that's why I'm having so much problems putting it all together.
[48:46] Valerie Beck: I think it's going to be amazing when you do finally put it together, because it is. I mean, we went from talking about just like throwing axes in your backyard, right. And the fun of it to like discovering, well, there are already people that are doing it. But, like, you've all. I. I think it's real cool that you found people that are doing. You found that you're really good at it and then still that you're sticking to your guns. Sticking to your guns. And because you know that the way that you have gone into this, it's elevating you. Right. Do you have an idea of, like, at least maybe if you don't know exactly how it's going to look right now, like, what is your mission for it?
[49:30] Walden Cox: My mission is to be able to affect every single person that I encounter in a positive way, whether they remember my face or name or not. I want them to have a positive little bit of magic from me one way or the other. And I've done humongous events. Like I do an ax throwing event inside of Denver Oktoberfest, which generally full amount of people is right around a quarter million every year. And I bring ax throwing inside of that, which to some people would sound totally insane because there's tens of thousands of inebriated people at any good any given time when I'm letting them throw things. But I'm really good at keeping them in line and I'm good at what I do. And I've found that I can affect those people in a matter of two to three minutes in a very positive way. And that made. That kind of led me towards the whole, ooh, mental health thing. And then now I have opportunities to work with people on the opposite side, people in recovery. Right. People who've essentially lost their way or lost their focus and need to find it again. And that opportunity to me means A lot more than just going and making a bunch of money throwing actions with drunk people. Granted, I'll still do that because it's fun. Don't worry. Like, I ain't changing that. That's a blast. But I've also found that it can be healing as well as just fun. You know, there's. There's a certain catharsis to throwing something at something, hearing that thunk, looking at the fact that you just hit the thing you were aiming at. You see, like, when people do that for the very first time, when they hit their hell, when they hit. When they stick the first one you see, usually see them be like, yeah. Or like, jump for joy. And when they hit their first bullseye, there's like. It's like a little kid getting a Christmas present. And I've worked with people who are handicapped, people that are as young as 3 and as old as 93, and the reaction's the same with every single one of them. And that's what I really love right there. That's what that's. That's. Out of all the world records I hold, out of all the tours I've done, my favorite thing is those freaking smiles. So it's all making me teary. That's weird. Like, I legitimately, like, care about this. So.
[51:48] Valerie Beck: Yeah, Yeah. I mean, I hear it, and I'm really excited to see what you create of it, because I want to ask about the recovery thing.
[51:59] Walden Cox: Okay.
[51:59] Valerie Beck: But I think before I do that. Because of the way that you grew up.
[52:04] Walden Cox: Yeah.
[52:05] Valerie Beck: It's almost like you are defaulted to embrace counterculture, like, alternative. Like, you know, just, like, not necessarily. It's like you do your own thing. Right. And, like, that's never been a question. So I wonder, was there ever a time where you felt like you had to choose that instead of it being the default?
[52:28] Walden Cox: Interesting. Yeah, there's been a few moments where I feel like I had to consciously choose to do my own thing more than, you know, just have it be the default. There's been moments in my life where I've been professional, button down, have a job.
[52:46] Valerie Beck: Now.
[52:46] Walden Cox: That sounds weird to say for many reasons, but, like, to make the decision to walk away from that sort of thing, to get myself back on the track that I wanted to be on. There has definitely been moments where I had to consciously say, I let myself get in a rut. I let myself start doing the thing that society or whatever thinks I should do, and I don't want that. Like, I'm pushing 50 and I still live my Life like a kid, but I have a grandkid, let alone kids. And so there's a weird balancing act when it comes to all this because you show them that it's okay to be a professional goof off. You have to show them how to do it right. Otherwise they're not. But that's the thing. I'm not sure how I did it. Like, it's like. So being an example is something I definitely get forced upon me. So I have to be. I have to be constantly aware of how other people see me, but not let that take over because then I get into those ruts of being that person that someone else thinks I should be. And there's a balancing act between that. Because when it comes to family and stuff, you really do need to be that person that they need you to be. But you like, I have this. I can't just be that. I have to keep chasing this because that's who I am. And if you want to grow to be the person you are, that's the best example I can give you.
[54:20] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[54:20] Walden Cox: Is the fact that I kept being me no matter what, but at the same time trying to balance the vision of the other people in my life along with my own. That's. That can get real tricky sometimes when you do what I do. Because like I said, my life is. Embraces a lot of chaos. So I try to make the chaos a lot of fun and try to control it as much as possible. But the chaos is definitely a driving force. Yeah, it's just hard to. Sometimes it's just like, whoa, back up a little bit. This is a little too much all at once. And right now I'm bordering on that. But at the same time I'm like, I haven't looked. It's not going off the rails yet. So let's just see where we're going and then make sure that we continue that direction. Even if it gets a little chaotic. The chaos will eventually come into order as new chaos starts to form. So I guess we've always seen it sort of is like you have this. It's like a comet, right? Yeah, it's this crazy ass just thing flying through the air. It could hit anything. It could, well, space, whatever, and it could do whatever it wants. But then there's this nice refined tail behind it. So from that chaos, there's a little bit of order back there, but there's always chaos moving forward. So it's a matter of keeping your eyes forward and backwards, but staying in the middle. I guess that's that now thing again.
[55:50] Valerie Beck: So I once called, I once described myself as an agent of chaos and I shamelessly do so now. And I think what I've come to realize is the world is chaos, right. But I think what most people's approaches to this is to over control and to operate from fear. And so when you can lean into the chaos a little bit and allow that and allow yourself to play with it a little bit more, I, I, to me that seems ultimately like a more healthy way to deal with it. Even though it's counter what a, a lot of people are doing.
[56:27] Walden Cox: Well, it's counterintuitive to what the way we're all trained, you know. But chaos is not going to go away. It's just going to be like if you try, the harder you try to control it and the harder you try to steer it, the harder it's going to be to do that. And so you kind of just have to let it drive at least a little bit, you know, it's going to keep happening. Like I said, you got to stay in the middle, let the chaos kind of be in front. You stay in the middle, let the order come out of the back. You got to be the filter for the chaos, I guess, you know, and that's something I've learned to do pretty well is filter that chaos down into different art forms, different passions and different, different little journeys that all turned into one big thing. You know, that chaotic route that's been bouncing around through space for me has picked up little things that have helped add to the person that I've become. And so I feel like sometimes, yeah, sometimes chaos gets a little too chaotic and you got to control it, but then if you control it too much, then it'll just end up exploding on you. So you gotta, it's that it's a weird balancing act, like I said, to be this sort of thing.
[57:36] Valerie Beck: Yeah. So I wanna, for at least for to wrap up the interview part of this, I wanna ask about the recovery part because, okay, you know, there are people recovering from addiction, there are people recovering from burnout, all of this other stuff. I mean, obviously when we talk, when we talk about recovery, in the main vernacular, it's usually like addiction, right?
[57:59] Walden Cox: Yeah, usually.
[58:00] Valerie Beck: So what is recovery to you?
[58:02] Walden Cox: It's very broad because, yeah, addiction to alcohol, to drugs, to sex, to whatever addiction is addiction. And that's part of something that people are in recovery for. Then there's ptsd, then there's, you know, any like, number of things that can be people dealing with mental issues. That they were born with, they're trying to overcome and feel more. You know, people on the spectrum that are trying to become just more themselves so they can live a fuller life. Like, I don't discriminate when I say recovery. I'm not just going after alcoholics. I'm not just going after anyone. I'm going after literally anyone who needs this. It can be kids that need to find a sense of confidence. You know, it can be people stuck in a rut that need to find something new to bust them out of a rut. It can be old people who need to feel worth, like they're not worthless, like they can still do something with them, like they can literally physically do something that they didn't think they could. It can be handicapped people who don't think that they can do something physical, but they can. It can be anything. And so when I say recovery and with this program, I'm building it in a way where the whole throwing things at things is only part of it. You know, it's an analog for being able to achieve anything. You know, especially for people who, like I said, handicapped people is a really big example because I've worked with people in wheelchairs, amputees, all kinds of stuff. But like, the whole going after recovery, it's people, even if it's people who don't have any of those issues, People who just have settled in their life and they want to try to find something new because they're like, just bored. There's any number of people who can benefit from not just the throwing side of this, but the, the career, the chasing your passion and the artistic side of it. And I'm really. I'm not going to discriminate against. Discriminate against any of it. This popped up this avenue because of the potential for working with recovering alcoholics, drug addicts, and homeless teenagers, because I have an opportunity to do that. So all these people in recovery literally can just have this service. And sure, at first it's just, let's just throw, throw stuff. But that leads to other conversations, that leads to actual breakthroughs, that leads to other gatherings that aren't based about throwing. You know, this is an actual program for people to find their own sense of self worth again. You know, find something to focus on that's not the thing that drove them to the place they are particularly.
[01:00:48] Valerie Beck: Do you have a name for your program yet?
[01:00:51] Walden Cox: Yes, actually. Well, kind of tossing around a couple. First one was, I actually said it. It's the throw acts feel good.
[01:01:00] Valerie Beck: I like that.
[01:01:01] Walden Cox: Yeah. That's a good one. And another one, it's a little more esoteric because it's bigger words. It's holistic ballistics. So, you know, mind bullets, I guess. But like, those are the two I've been throwing around. I think I'll probably go with throw axe feel good because it's very. It's just simple.
[01:01:22] Valerie Beck: Yeah.
[01:01:22] Walden Cox: It's easy to remember, it's easy to understand. And I think that that's. That's something that this definitely needs to be. It needs to be something that people can easily understand because they're going to take to. Each one of them is going to have their own little journey. And then if it's a group like, let's say one of these recovery groups, then they can all talk amongst themselves about what they got out of it and things like that. So there's a. There's so much possibility here that it's kind of overwhelming because it's like, whoa, this is all coming from all the things that I've ever done. And all the stories I have personally are relevant to all of this. You know, I've never been an addict myself, but I've been around a lot of them being a musician, you know, and. But I have dealt with mental health and PTSD sort of things. I know I can work with that. So it's just like I've been around a lot of this stuff that I'm trying to help already one way or the other. So I guess I have a pretty good resume for doing this.
[01:02:22] Valerie Beck: Yeah. I'm super excited for you. This is gonna. I. I'm always looking for people who are wanting to do things differently because I think the world needs that. I think we're to look for the generic now is just not relevant anymore, you know?
[01:02:40] Walden Cox: Agreed. It's everywhere. Most everything is a copy of something else.
[01:02:45] Valerie Beck: Yeah. So with that, let's. Let's wrap it up, tell people how we can get more information from you about your upcoming stuff, like. Yeah. And where to find you.
[01:02:54] Walden Cox: Well, right now I am currently building my website, so it will be blackmetalaxe.com I own the website. It's just not live because I'm not quite happy with it yet, but I'm available through. Available through several forms of social media. And I'm always willing to talk with anyone about any of this as I'm building up. I have the Instagram, I have TikTok, I have YouTube. And those are all you. Just. Just search Black Metal Ax and you'll find it very easily. You see me with a big white beard throwing things in very weird ways, and you'll know you found the right spot. On Facebook, I go by my real name. I'm Walden Cox. But I think if you look up Black Metal Ax because it's meta also, you'd still find me. But, yeah, anyone can reach out at any time, and I'm very, very willing to talk about any of this with pretty much anyone, so. Awesome.
[01:03:47] Valerie Beck: Well, thank you, Walden, for coming on the show today.
[01:03:50] Walden Cox: Well, thank you, Valerie, for having me.
