[00:00] Valerie: Rise, renew, reconnect. Welcome to from the Ashes, a podcast where every conversation ignites hope and healing. Today is a special day to celebrate having passed over ten episodes. I invited my new friend Rikio to help me reflect upon the amazing conversations I've had on this podcast so far. We had a blast digging deeper into the themes of the show, and it's the first time a guest has almost moved me to tears. I want to thank everyone who has followed my journey so far, and I know you're going to love this episode with Rikio Inouye.
[00:45] Valerie: Hi, everyone. Welcome back to from the ashes. My name is Valerie Beck, and I am your host for this podcast. And today I have my friend Rikio Inouye with me to do a very special episode. Welcome Rikio to the show.
[00:59] Rikio: Hi. Thank you so much for having me, Valerie. I'm really excited to be here.
[01:02] Valerie: I am really excited to. And this is going to be really fun because today Rikio is actually going to be partially interviewing me, and we're going to do a little bit of reflection and back and forth on how the podcast has been going, what I've been learning. And then also, we're going to do a little bit of banter because both Rikio and I have a shared experience of teaching Japanese. I'm sorry, not teaching Japanese. Teaching English in Japan. We were on the jet program at different times, very different times. But it is an experience that links us together, and we've done a lot of really great bonding just over that experience. So I'm really excited to bring Rikio on because he has really impressed me with his speaking skills. He's doing political science at Princeton University, doing doctorate, I believe.
[01:52] Rikio: That's right.
[01:53] Valerie: Yeah. He is a very impressive individual, and I'm very excited for him to be here today. I want to mention first the jet connection and ask you a little bit about your experience with Jet. Because the Jet program is basically, it's the Japanese exchange and teaching program, and it's sponsored by the Japanese government. And what they do is they bring people over to Japan who are largely English speaking, and they place them in different prefectures, lectures in Japan, either to teach in local schools or to do cultural exchange work at local government offices. So there are hundreds, hundreds of people going to Japan each year who are embarking on this inventor, and they basically leave their home countries, and they stay from anywhere from a year to five or even six years. And so it is a life transforming experience. So, Riki, I was in Toyama from 2017 to 2020. Give me just, like, a very quick reflection on what that experience was like for you. And maybe some of the takeaways are big ways that it has transformed your life.
[03:06] Rikio: Yeah. I think your description of this program as transformative is so incredibly spot on. I had not had this lifelong dream of going to live in Japan. It's something that my twin brother, who also went on the jet program at the same time, did have a dream for. But I remember applying and going on the jet program having little sense of how long I would stay. It's a one year contract, and I figured it would be a useful opportunity for me to reconnect to my culture and to my heritage. I'm fourth generation Japanese American, didn't know any Japanese before I went and didn't know where I was going. I had never heard of Toyama prefecture, but I found that the opportunity to mentor students, to connect with a community, and to provide an opportunity for students through different kinds of English education, debate, speech contests, was something that was profoundly fulfilling, and that was part of why I stayed so long. Those three years were some of the best years of my life, and I will say leaving was one of the hardest goodbyes I've ever had to do, but it definitely changed how I thought about myself, my identity, my sense of connection to this place. And I don't regret going on this adventure one bit.
[04:28] Valerie: Amazing. And I would second that. It was the three best years of my life, or one of the three best years of my life. And there is just this sense of, like, you get to rediscover yourself. And so I would love to ask you, what were some ways that you did rediscover yourself in your identity? What did you realize about who you are?
[04:55] Rikio: Yeah, that's a great question and one that I very much appreciate. I remember growing up having a fairly clear sense that I'm Japanese American. I had heard about the experience of Japanese Americans in the camps in the United States growing up during World War two, but I had always felt, yeah, disconnected from the place and the people of Japan. And while I had studied a little bit of Japanese politics in undergrad as a way to try and connect, there was still this profound feeling that I didn't know the people, that I didn't know the place. And so when I was there, I finally had a chance to connect to the people and build community. But one of the things I also really wrestled with Washington who am I? Who am I there? Right? I look Japanese. I have a Japanese first name, which is rather unconventional for most Japanese Americans. And like, perhaps you in your time on jet, we can pass sort of physically as Japanese. And yet the way we think, the way our values are aligned, are also quite distinct. And so I wrestled a lot with exactly who I wanted to be and how I wanted to be seen in the community. And I often felt I wanted people to recognize that I am descended from Japan, and yet I'm also not Japanese, not in the way that most people think of Japanese. So I wrestled with that a lot. But I also came to realize that I was initially seeking some sort of external validation from my identity. And thankfully, the communities and the people that I connected with helped me realize that that wasn't something I needed validated from the outside. It was something that I could come to terms with on my own with the support of these other people.
[06:44] Valerie: Yeah, that's really beautiful. I think. I don't know. I don't know what it's like, actually, to go as a fourth generation Japanese American, that's very different from going as, you know, as an Asian American who's not Japanese. Right. So, on this podcast, we talk a lot about reinventing oneself, not from ego, per se, but actually transcending what the ego says we should be doing and what we actually are called to do from the soul. And I think what is, what you're saying right now is that, like, you were able to kind of transcend also that need for that validation. So what was on the other side of it?
[07:28] Rikio: That's a powerful question, and I can think through some of the answer to that with an anecdote for how I was actually wrestling with this question specifically. So I worked with high school students. I was working at one private high school in Toyama prefecture. And I remember asking them one day how they thought about me. I asked them very simply, what do you think when you see me? Do you see someone who's Japanese but grew up in America? Do you see someone who is American but has a Japanese name? Like, what? What is it? Who is it that you see? And I just remember their response was so profound and yet so simple, and they just said, oh, we see, riki o sensei. It was the most heartwarming piece of wisdom that I'll never forget. And I think if you're. If I'm asked to reflect on what was on the other side of that, I think there was a sense of peace in that. I no longer felt the need to prove myself. I didn't have to feel like I wasn't Japanese enough or I wasn't American enough or whatever it happened to be. I know who we are depends a lot on the context that we're in. I'm sure this is something that you have experienced in your time in Japan and then your experience coming back. So, so much of who we are is affected by our context. But I think the dominant feeling that I came back with was a sense of serenity in identity. Right. It doesn't have to have a clean answer. It doesn't have to be a single answer that remains unchanging. It's much more of a journey than it is a single destination.
[09:11] Valerie: That's really profound. And I. That it's the kind of thing that makes going to Japan just often so soul moving is that, like, you will get those moments like that where someone will say something to you or you'll see something, and it's just so. It is so peaceful, and it's just so. It communicates the human experience of just being.
[09:39] Rikio: Yeah. And. And I actually wanted to ask you a little bit about your time on the jet program, because if I recall correctly, in one of your interviews, you had mentioned that during this time of your life, you had actually had a window into a sense of self confidence, a self awareness, a sense of authenticity. And obviously, your perspective on this has grown and changed a lot since you've returned. But I wanted to hear a little bit more about that, because it sounds like, as it was, for me, your time in Japan was quite transformative as well.
[10:12] Valerie: Yeah, it was a lot. I think going in as an Asian American who spoke, like, a little bit of Japanese. Like, I minored in Japanese in college, so I knew a little bit. And so I knew enough to pretty much blend in almost from the get go. It was a weird feeling of suddenly feeling very at peace in my space. And I don't think it has so much to do with the fact that I look like people, but the fact that people were just willing to allow me to exist and not comment on it so much, you know? And that's a strange thing to say, because in America, it's really diverse. And, like, oftentimes I take that diversity for granted, but there's still an element of, like, not blending in here, and there's still an element of people being in your space all of the time that isn't there in Japan, because personal space is so valued and just allowing people to have some sort of comfort just, you know, being together with others, but not necessarily always having to be in each other's energy so much, if that makes sense. So that's one thing that I recall happening, and it just gave me a little bit of room to think about what it is that I want to do with my time here on earth, beyond just like, okay, what is it that, like, you know, society should tell me I should do? And it gave me room to contribute without feeling the pressure of contributing. Because when you go on jet, sometimes you're just landed in the middle of the country in a rural area. You're not actually given that many responsibilities. Like, yes, I taught English and I wrote a curriculum and did all of that, but I actually had a lot of time, and that time allowed me to think about, like, well, no one's really expecting me to do that much more. So now what can I create?
[12:21] Rikio: Hmm.
[12:23] Valerie: Yeah. So there was just like, this profound freedom of being on jet that I was allowed. And it, you know, there's a bunch of factors that go into why that was.
[12:34] Rikio: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I really hear that. I think having that space to think, having that room to breathe, and then really center, what is it you want to do with your time is something that I'm sure a lot of people would like to feel. And I would imagine in your work that you've started, you're often inviting people very directly into that space to recreate that sense of temporary solitude. Or perhaps not solitude, but a sense of certainty so that you can wrestle with these really deep and fundamental questions about what kind of legacy we want to have or what are our values and to what ends do we want to apply ourselves?
[13:20] Valerie: Absolutely. That's what I strive to do. And it's been hard for me to put that into very solid structure and language. It's like, how can I recreate that experience of freedom in a place where people don't feel freedom? How can I create inner peace in a place where that's not really valued? And that has been the challenge. You know, I think I can. I can bring the structure to a point, but there's also so much that a person has to go through when they're not within my space, right, when they're out there in the world doing their own thing. And, you know, I think there, to an extent, we can all only do our best to provide a clearing for others to have. Personal transformation.
[14:08] Rikio: Yeah. Yeah. I think one of the things that I love about your podcast is you are able to at least create some small windows into people's journeys as they wrestle with these questions. And so even as someone maybe in a different place on their own journey, when they're able to hear your exchange with your guests, hear about the challenges they've experienced with ego, or rediscovery of dance, or a kind of reckoning with spirituality and sexuality, I would imagine that there's an opportunity for them to consider different perspectives or different ways of looking at their own life. And so that actually makes me really curious. As you've done something like ten of these episodes so far, what are some of the things that you have observed about this process and what have been some of the lessons learned along the way?
[15:01] Valerie: Okay, so one of the things that have been pretty consistent, the themes that have been pretty consistent throughout, is that at some point, there is a choice that is made, a very clear choice that is made to turn the direction that is going to be scarier and that's going to be harder. And sometimes that turn is made out of force, either by emergency or whatnot. And sometimes it's made out of pain, and sometimes it's made out of curiosity. But every single time, I think people are faced with that choice. Right. And that's the hero's journey that some of my guests have even talked about. The person is sitting at home doing what they do, and then someone comes in and be like, hey, knock on the door. Like, you have the choice to go on this journey and leave your home and everything, you know, or you can stay and everything will be the same. And the people that I have talked to have been the ones who have answered the calling. And I think that's what it takes. We are totally okay. We're totally fine if we don't want to answer the calling, but it's just a different life. Yeah, yeah. And it's actually, you know, it's choosing the life that will be predictable and will, to be, to an extent, it will be safe, or at least it will have the illusion of safety. And then those who answer the calling, they're taking a chance. They know that it could be dangerous. But they also feel like on the other side of this journey is access to something that is way more free, way more profound, and way more theme or authentic to them. Have you ever read the Alchemist, by any chance?
[16:59] Rikio: I have not. Unfortunately, though I know that many of your guests have and have talked about it a great deal.
[17:06] Valerie: Okay. I recommend that book just to. That book really illustrates the journey in a very succinct way and still very profound.
[17:16] Rikio: So, yeah. Yeah. I love what you said about the ways in which something like fear, something about pain could elicit, it could catalyze this sort of journey. And yet anytime we embark on some major transition, it's scary, there's uncertainty, and we're leaving the status quo that we know. And I remember when I was thinking about applying for graduate schools, I was really concerned with this fear of rejection. I knew how many hurdles and hoops I’d have to jump through just to get in, just to complete this program, then to find a job, then to get tenure. And I could easily construct all of these barriers to my own desire to take a different step after Japan. And I remember coming back to this question of what would be something that I would regret not doing. And I don’t think of myself as someone who’s had a single dream career my whole life, but I thought about what are the things that are important to me? And it was mentoring the next generation. It was helping to invite people to be curious about the world and to challenge their priors and to think critically about the difficult problems that were living through experiencing, and also to tackle some of those on my own. And I thought this path of trying to be a professor requires that I go get a PhD. And I know that in ten or 20 or 50 years, I would certainly regret not trying. And if I try and things don't work out or I pivot and take another direction, at least I know that I gave myself that opportunity. So I know that. And this is just like one example, but I would imagine that there's a lot of parallels to many of the people that you've spoken with. When there are these decision points about what we want to do, who we want to be and do, we feel like we have the support and the courage to break from what we have known and what we've done before?
[19:16] Valerie: Yeah, and I want to add on to that because I think it's not just one choice. I think it's a continuous commitment to the choice again and again that makes the difference. Right. We can face our fears once and then shrink back into our little shell and then not make another choice again to change and we'll still be stuck. But it's just the willingness to face failure over and over and over again that that facing failure becomes like a muscle. And it's. It's not easy. Like, I struggle with it daily. And after jet, I went through the roughest period of my life. It went from the best period of my life to the roughest. It was. There was a severe amount of reverse culture shock, and I went into grad school. And I didn't have a great experience with grad school doing international education, so there was a lot to reckon with. And it for, I would say probably a decade I shrunk down and I was very lost of like, what? How do I. I don't even know what to do anymore. And it's only been recently where I can consciously look at myself and see when I'm being fearful and see when I'm playing small because I'm afraid of that rejection. And it's taken a lot of training and healing to be able to get to that point.
[20:48] Rikio: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that idea that it's a series of continued choices that create this path to something new, potentially to something better. And I really hear how that initial transition back and the numerous things that you did between your time in Japan and where you are now involved a lot of challenges and a lot of difficult questions that you were wrestling with. And this actually brings me to something that I was really curious to hear your thoughts on. I think a lot of times how we think of ourselves, how we think of our story is the product of a series of vignettes and stories that we tell ourselves about ourselves. And yet, in the work that you're doing now and in the podcast that you've had, as you've heard these stories of your guests regarding their own lives, I would imagine that there's also opportunities for you to evaluate what is the story that you have about your time from Japan. Since Japan until now, have you found that changing at all?
[21:51] Valerie: I think it has changed because where I am is changing. And that's the thing is, like, no story is ever 100% truth. It is a retelling that you're telling yourself again and again and you're altering your perspectives as you go along. I would say, I think when it was happening in the moment, I could have. I could have. I think I did blame, you know, the circumstances more of why I was so upset and why I was so depressed of like, grad school not being aligned with what I wanted to do. And like, even just my morals, I was upset that people weren't treating me the way I wanted to be treated. But at the end of day also, now there's an added piece of language. There is that I chose all situations, I chose to go to grad school, I chose to leave Japan. Right. And those choices were not always quite. They were definitely made from ego. I just couldn't see it at the time. And they were made out of fear or obligation that I couldn't see, at the time was not authentic to what I actually wanted for myself because I don't even think at the time I gave myself the permission to think about what I truly wanted. It had to be about somebody else's desires.
[23:21] Rikio: Yeah, that's really powerful. I hear, in what you just shared, this realization, perhaps a sobering one, that the journey that you've been on, as challenging and as painful as it has been in some ways, is not purely the result of circumstance and is not purely result of these other structures. Right. There's also agency in the choices that you made, and that's difficult to sit with, the fact that we are sort of reaping those outcomes. And yet I also hear, as you see, how that stemmed perhaps from ego, as you were saying, that there's an awareness now for how you can be more intentional about the kind of work you want to do, how you want to be treated, how you want to balance these various factors that provide meaning for you in your life. Is that something that, I mean, it sounds like you mentioned earlier, this is like a daily practice, a daily series of choices, and with a new business and a new project, I'm sure there's a lot of things that you have to be doing and a lot of work that you're always thinking about. How have you found that balance as you've been continuing on your journey as a coach?
[24:32] Valerie: I think the choice to become coach was when I finally made the commitment to the journey towards authentic self. And I have to constantly then be in the work myself, too, of looking at my behavior, looking at my thought patterns, looking at everything and making sure that I'm not fooling myself anymore, because it's really easy to do that. And speaking from an Asian American perspective now, because I've seen it both in myself and in a lot of the people around me, that there is always this need to respect elders wishes, to also try to make your parents proud. There's the element of carrying on the torch of culture because we're American and our parents and our ancestors want us to, like, live through their culture and their history, too. Right? And so there's that added pressure to do that. And I've seen how it can really tear at people, and there's an inner conflict because there's something that the soul as an individual wants, and then there's all of this that they also kind of have to acknowledge and respect. And it's just, how do you reconcile those two parts peacefully in a way that is still authentic? And I had to really step back and look at my conditioning and be like, I think a lot of the choices I have made in the past that have kept me small, that have kept me stagnant in my career have been due to trying to do it other people's way and do it the way that my supposed culture told taught me to do. But it wasn't the way that I knew I was going to be able to reach my fuller potential. And then when I actually finally stood up for myself and started to do things my own way, no one was there to be like, hey, I think you're doing it wrong. So how much of it then was me just telling myself, like, people are going to be disappointed and angry at me, as opposed to the reality of. Of things is like, no one's really angry at you.
[26:56] Rikio: Yeah. Yeah. I was actually just thinking, when people find and realize that they want to do something different and they have the courage to put themselves on a different path, sometimes one of the big challenges is that the communities that they may be familiar with or the people that they've surrounded themselves with may not have that expectation of that individual yet. It sounds like in your case, it wasn't necessarily that the people around you were providing some sort of negative feedback, but perhaps it was nevertheless a rather unexpected experience because maybe there was expected pushback that just didn't come. Is that. Am I understanding that right? No.
[27:40] Valerie: So I've always been so, I've always been very good at being talented, which is a cocky thing to say, but here's how I'll break it down. If I go into a job, I will do a good job. If I take on a hobby, I would be great at it. This creates the illusion that I love these things, that I love being around doing a great job, that I love doing whatever I do. And sometimes I do love it. I do like it, I enjoy it, but it's not my soul's calling. And it's just that there are a lot of times where it's been like, the teacher or the employer or whatnot. Be like, you have so much potential. I don't want to see this go to waste. And so there's a positive reinforcement that is very well intentioned, that is still kind of like, it is feeding my self esteem. But at the same time, it was kind of grinding against, like, well, but also I, you know, sometimes I'm doing a good job because it's like, it's what I do. It's, why wouldn't I try my best? But I'm not giving myself the chance to see, like, well, is it also what makes me happy? Is it also what is authentic to me? And this is really important to me, as you can tell, is, like, authenticity is hugely important to me because I've gone through life being very miserable, doing things that are. That are great, that are great on the outside. And I. And for a lot of people, they would just, like, they would probably say, like, be thankful for that. Like, be grateful that you are talented and whatnot. And. But the thing is, like, I also put myself into situations where that can be taken advantage of, where I haven't been able to support myself because I always, I'll do it for free sometimes or whatnot. And so it just. There's this underlying. Where there was this underlying lack of self worth running through everything, I think that was making it very hard for me to sustain my energy. And I think at the end of the day, it's like, if I had the ability to sustain my energy, then it wouldn't have been such a problem.
[29:45] Rikio: Yeah, that's really powerful. I really thank you for sharing that. I think even in the way that you phrased this idea that you have spent a lot of your life succeeding and thriving in ways that in, I guess, many ways that people sort of expect and are sort of conventional, even the way that you had phrased that, I thought, was a departure from how sometimes we might, as Asian Americans, I think we are often encouraged to be very modest and to be very humble. And yet I heard this simultaneous awareness of, like, no, I am good at these things, or at least I can do a good job in these things, and I'm proud that I can. And yet I also am aware that this doesn't quite align with what feels authentic to what my values are. And so in the way that you phrase that, I even heard this kind of what I would imagine is a process of growth and the result of so much of the journey that you've been on and that you're inviting the people that you work with to be on. So I just wanted to shout out even that particular phrasing, I think is indicative of the journey that you've been on.
[30:54] Valerie: Thank you. Yeah. And it is interesting for me to use that language because I often talk about with my clients that what has made you who you are, what has caused you immense success in certain areas, have also caused you immense failures in other areas. And you can see where that is. Right. So for me, I was really good at giving my own energy and really being very skilled. But at the same time, I was not so good at asking for. I was not so good at, like, taking more than what I can that people are willing to give me. So I didn't know how to ask for my needs. My mentality was that if I work hard enough, if I stand out enough, people will just naturally want to give me more. And that's not the truth. It's just sometimes in my past, maybe that worked. But then more and more as I got into the real world, were like, especially in business, right? You can't just wait for people to recognize your value. And so that paradigm, I can no longer live with it. If I wanted to continue the path that I'm on, right.
[32:13] Rikio: I would imagine both in terms of, can I live with this from a financial standpoint and can I live with this in terms of how I feel in my own skin and in the way that I'm being recognized, or more likely, like, not recognized for the work that I'm doing? I would imagine that that's really important. And yet I would also imagine that coming to that realization was itself very challenging and the product of a lot of intense thought. What was that like for you? And how does that experience that you have help you connect with the people that you're working with?
[32:53] Valerie: Yeah, I think there's just a willingness to be honest in a way that people don't expect. Like, to an extent, being humble can be very deceiving. And being. To put out a Persona of any kind, right, where you're constantly wearing a mask of, like, this is who I am. But then you're hiding a lot that's underneath. Even if you have the best of intentions, there's a lack of integrity. And one of the base, like, one of the foundations for things being workable is integrity. And there's so many layers of this, we don't even realize that a lot of the time we're not being in integrity by telling a white lie, by kind of putting our heads down and doing what. Doing what we're being told rather than sticking up for ourselves. And those behaviors are done out of fear, fear retribution, retaliation and whatnot. I don't know if I'm answering your question, but I think there's that need for honesty that I continue to peel the layers back as I go on my journey and as I develop myself as a coach, that I realize that's something that I'm not willing to compromise. And I see where in the world this is being compromised and how things have come to be as they are, and I see why I have such a conviction around this integrity. So, you know, as a political science major, I'm sure you have a lot to say about that or to even process around that. Right. It's like there's a lot of. There's an immense lack of integrity in the political world, and I don't think people think enough about what the consequences of that are.
[35:05] Rikio: Yeah, I think there's a lot of reasons why people move in the direction of shying away from information that doesn't align with their priors or that challenges their sort of belief structures. And I think when it comes to the integrity point that you raise, I really hear how challenging that is. I mean, I think about, on average, I think a lot of people would like and do hold a view of themselves as good people. Like, I think, for the most part, we'd like to think that we're all pretty good people. And so when we're asked to sit with the ways in which we may not be living in accordance with our values or the ways in which our behaviors don't align with who we say and who we'd like to think we are, that, I think, creates a profound sense of discomfort, a discomfort that, frankly, I think a lot of people would prefer not to deal with. And so I think there's a lot of barriers to people wrestling with this. And these range. Right. Like, some of this is cultural. Right. So maybe there's the element of certain cultures, like in some Asian American cultures, talking about how you feel wrestling with these uncertainties or larger questions is not something that's particularly welcome. Maybe there's elements of gender dynamics and norms. Right. Like, I'm very grateful that I have a really intimate group of high school friends, many of whom are men. And we're very open about the things that we're struggling with, the kind of insecurities we may have, the points that we'd like to celebrate. But I also acknowledge that that's quite rare. It's quite exceptional. And I don't think that there's a lot of spaces for men in particular to build the kind of emotional skillset that would help them wrestle with this tension in integrity. And that is all presuming that people are self aware enough of the sort of divergence between what they are doing, what they are believing, and how they would like to see themselves. So there's a lot of elements to this that certainly make this issue of how am I living and how do I feel I should be living, given how I'd like to see myself. I think there's a lot of reasons why that's very difficult. But those are some of the elements that sort of emerge to me as someone who is trained in political science.
[37:40] Valerie: I guess that's a really good point. And I often reflect on this is like, I did not choose an easy path. I chose a path where I'm trying, I really am trying to find the people who are willing to do some of the hardest work that you might ever do as a human being. And that's okay. I think I've come to terms with the fact that this is not for everyone. And that gives me some peace, too, that it's not everybody that I need to talk to, but it is that I want to stand strong in the voice that I do have and still allow that to be a voice. Right. Because just because there are few people who are willing to do the work doesn't mean that it should not be acknowledged and that it shouldn't be done. Yeah. So thank you for pointing that out.
[38:30] Rikio: I was actually curious about the, the point that you made about finding people on this journey to do some of this really difficult work. And one of the things that I noticed about, and I think is really wonderful about the community that you're building through this podcast and through your work, is that you're finding a community of like minded people, quite diverse in the kind of life experiences, quite diverse in the paths taken, perhaps, but. But perhaps unified in their desire to engage with a lot of these questions, a lot of this self reflection, and a lot of consideration for how we may be more aligned with who we'd like to be? And one of the questions that I had was, are there, are there times where you also want to engage with people who seem less inclined to do some of that hard reflecting. Is there, is there a perspective that you also wanting to engage with, or is that something that within the mission and the purpose that you have in your work, that that is something that you already want people to be sort of on the same page about? Because I'd imagine that that's. It's not as quite as binary as people who are ready to do the work and people who aren't. Right. I'm sure there's a lot of people who are like, potentially open to it, but haven't maybe thought about it in the terms that you are and then provided those frameworks.
[39:49] Valerie: Yeah, I think you make a very good point. And so, no, there are certain people that I take in that are not necessarily ready to do the deepest deep work, but may start to see that the way that they are living their life is no longer aligned because they are seeing changes in their body and their mentality that's not quite serving them. And this is the beauty of ayurveda. So, ayurveda being the modality of medicine that I practice, is that it talks a lot about the spiritual journey that underlies the health journey. And there is a point in life with a lot of people, not everyone, but in a lot of people, where they are wrapped up in a lot of the turbulence, a lot of the turbulence comes from within. But then there's also them feeling it in their body. And, you know, they might be like, but I've done everything right. I like, you know, nothing has. I haven't been abusing any kind of substances or whatnot, and yet I am suffering. And I think a lot of people do start to just question, like, what's going on? And we are unable, really, to answer that question from a western perspective, especially a western medical perspective, because it is very tied to mind. And so I provide a space, really, where people can heal their bodies and experiment with becoming more familiar with their own needs. So it's a gradual process. And then when you get to a point where you have healed and you have seen how those little changes in the way that you do things add up and make a difference in your lives, then it opens up the space for you to consider the larger questions. And then, because you've listened to everybody on the podcast so far, you could see, like, people, even though they, a lot of them are asking the bigger questions, they're still at different points in that journey. And I'm still in that journey, too. I don't consider myself to be at the top at all. I'm very much a work in progress, and I think part of it is recognizing that life is a work in progress.
[42:06] Rikio: Absolutely. And I was curious on this, on this point of people coming in at different stages, I think one of the things that could be challenging in your work is that, and you've discussed this with some of your guests as well, that the healing that you have and practice through Ayurveda is perhaps less familiar to people who are trained or have come to expect, the solution must come in the form of a pill from western medicine. Or that if the solution can't be explained to me with in the terms that I grew up with, or maybe I've been brought up in a background that isn't particularly spiritual, for example, it may be hard for people to find entry or access to the things that you're offering. And so what would you say to those individuals who may be questioning but not knowing that this is really a path forward for them?
[43:04] Valerie: Yeah, well, I would say that they're not alone because I'm definitely questioning, too. And I think part of why I have such faith in what I do is because I allow myself to question. When I started ayurveda school, I was very open in accepting what I was being taught and just kind of taking it for what it was, word for word. But then there came a point where I, I was like, you know what? This, I need to start to question because some of this doesn't always align. Some of it just doesn't add up all the time. And, you know, there is no one system of medicine that is perfect. They're all man made. And from that, you know, they all come from a flawed perspective. That's just what it is. Even like western medicine, eastern medicine, they all come from the eyes of human. So. And humans have beliefs, humans have prejudices as much as we try not to. And so when people come to me and they're like, I don't know about this ayurveda stuff, which not many people have actually said, but, like, you know, I don't really understand that. Like people have said, like, I don't really understand eastern medicine, I think it seems like you're, it's, it's like, not so modern, et cetera, et cetera. I've heard that. I just invite them to consider just the basics of, like, considering that your mind and body are connected and when it's just that, I can even start to talk about modern medicine because we can. Modern research is pointing towards, like, the gut being a huge part of the nervous system. And so what you eat directly impacts your mood. Right? It's just stuff like that. And so I am always doing my own research as well to bridge the gap and link pieces of the modern and the ancient wisdom so that it makes sense for us as individuals.
[45:05] Rikio: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love that openness to staying curious. And I think that that's probably what a lot of people are wanting to feel for themselves as well. And so as you think about where you've come from and now also where you're going, I love this idea that you're continuing to ask questions and assessing, updating and improving. So where do you see your work going? Where do you see this podcast going in the future? Because you've had a wealth of experience so far, lots of lessons learned. Where do you see this headed?
[45:45] Valerie: Great so when I started this podcast, it was kind of for two reasons. One was to give myself a voice for my business and what I do, and the other was to provide a space for me to listen to other people's stories and really kind of create a space for conversation. I will be completely honest. I love having conversations. I love having deep conversations. I would probably do this for free, like, you know, given the opportunity. I mean, I am essentially doing this for free, but it is something that I deeply enjoy and I find brings immense value both to my life, but to other, I think to other people's lives, too. And it just. I love giving people a space to dig deeper. So, as for the podcast, I would love to continue to go down the route of talking to people who share the same interest and who want to dig deeper into the meaning of life and. Yeah, and just be honest and open and share the journey in terms of my business and where I see that going. It has evolved from being very largely focused on ayurveda and physical health to being using the tools to improve physical health, to access greater levels of openness in the mind, and also to find a way to have inner peace. The issue that I have with western models of psychology and mental health is that it's very pathology focused, and it doesn't allow us the room to consider that everyone needs mental health support. Everyone needs physical health support, right. And there's wellness involved. Like, we want to be mentally well, we want to be physically well. It's not something that is that we could just let run rampant in terms of feeling bad about ourselves and whatnot, and just allow us to go through life that way. I think in the past there has been the narrative of, like, mental health isn't a thing and you just need to suck it up, but it creates individuals with behaviors that are harmful, and so, and that that continues on through generations and generations. So if we want to heal as a collective and if we want to have a more harmonious society, we need to look at mental health. And not only from like a diagnosing perspective, but how do we support each other to just have healthier minds? So that's in a nutshell. That's what the focus of my work is, is to provide people with a way to maintain good mental health and wellness and to shift the rhetoric around what that is. Mental health.
[48:50] Rikio: Yeah, yeah. I love what you've shared, and I think one thing that I fully resonate with your love of talking to people and talking about more substantive things, I love doing this with my friends, and I'm so thrilled that I have the opportunity to do this with you. It's really wonderful that this chance meeting from a jet event has led to a new friendship and a wonderful series of follow up conversations. But what I hear in what you shared is that you're someone who comes alive when you are able to see others, but also be seen fully and in complexity by others. And if I may, it sounds like in your work as well, one of the things that you're doing is inviting people to truly see themselves. And maybe that's something that a lot of us don't easily do on our own. Maybe it's not entirely comfortable, but I think when you said helping people find inner peace and helping to support their mental health, I couldn’t help but imagine someone finally seeing themselves for the first time or in a new way. Not to say that we have never seen ourselves, but that you’re offering and inviting them a new perspective that would allow them to see themselves from a different lens. And that can be quite transformative, just as the jet program was transformative for us. I would imagine that the work that you’re doing will be transformative for a lot of your clients and for the friends who are lucky enough to have you in their lives.
[50:27] Valerie: Oh, thank you so much. That is a wonderful way of putting it. And yes, I do want to thank the JET program. As you can probably hear from both me and Rikio, it is experience that is unparalleled to any other, and it really just has brought such a richness to my life. And so, and I feel like so much of my journey was started from being able to take that big leap right into the unknown. Right. Just leaving my home country and leaving a place that I knew everyone to a place where I knew no one, in the middle of rural Japan and being told, just. Just do something. Yeah. All right, well, with that, let's close it up. Any final thoughts from you, Rikio, before we leave our audience today?
[51:24] Rikio: No, I just want to say thank you so much for bringing me on. I've very much enjoyed this conversation and I really look forward to seeing the next wave of guests that you bring on and the conversations that you'll have. I'm an eager listener, and I would recommend everyone else who's listening to refer to their friends and to drop those reviews because I know that they really helped the podcast.
[51:46] Valerie: Awesome. Thank you, Rikio, for being on here. I was not mistaken when I thought you would be a great interviewer. So thank you so much. And we will catch you next time.
